Ashamed to Admit
Are you ashamed to admit you're not across the big issues and events affecting Jews in Australia, Israel and around the Jewish world?
In this new podcast from online publication The Jewish Independent, Your Third Cousin Tami Sussman and TJI's Dashiel Lawrence tackle the week's 'Chewiest and Jewiest' topics.
Ashamed to Admit
Episode #15 When There is Peace with Ittay Flescher
Upon hearing the news of the murder of six Israelis who were held hostage in Gaza on Sept 1st, Jewish communities were thrust into mourning. Since then, it has been very difficult for many to speak about these deaths and it’s a rare gift to be able to communicate articulately while in the depths of grief. With his striking capacity for empathy and hope, TJI’s Jerusalem correspondent Ittay Flescher joined Tami and Dash to describe the despair many in Israel in the Jewish world feel.
‘The Holy and the Broken’ by Ittay Flescher is now available for pre-order at ittay.au It will be out in January 2025 in bookstores across Australia, published by HarperCollins.
Ittay can also be found on social media at @ittay78 and on TJI where he writes a regular column from Jerusalem, imagining a different future for all Israelis and Palestinians.
This episode's closing song by The Bashevis Singers (and thank you to the band for letting us use the song).
Read more about Mistorim - Hidden Places.
Other articles mentioned:
https://thejewishindependent.com.au/is-the-philadelphi-corridor-really-worth-more-than-the-lives-of-the-hostages
https://thejewishindependent.com.au/grief-and-blame-over-hamas-murder-of-six-hostages
https://thejewishindependent.com.au/israelis-stand-together-to-alleviate-starvation-in-gaza
Email your feedback, questions, show ideas etc: ashamed@thejewishindependent.com.au
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Hi everyone. Welcome to a special episode of A Shame to Admit. I'm just letting you know that Tammy and I are doing something a bit different today For our regular listeners. You'd know the format of the podcast well now. Tammy usually brings in a topic she's ashamed to admit she doesn't know a lot about, and I try to help her unpack it. We have a few laughs along the way.
Speaker 2:We do Thanks, dash, but as many of you know, the Australian Jewish community, like many Jewish communities around the world, are in mourning once again. Having received news of the murder of six Israelis who were held hostage in Gaza for close to 11 months, it has been very difficult for many of us to speak at all, let alone put our feelings into some kind of coherent sentence. It's actually a rare gift to be able to communicate articulately while in the depths of grief, isn't it?
Speaker 1:We're lucky to know someone who is able to do that, Someone many of you have been asking to bring back onto the show because of his capacity for empathy and hope, even during the darkest days of Israel's war. That's TJI's Jerusalem correspondent Itai Flesher.
Speaker 2:You know him from his podcast From the Yarra River to the Mediterranean Sea. His social media slides and stories provide so much comfort to people around the world and we couldn't think of a better person to speak to today. So we'll still play our opening theme music.
Speaker 1:And I'll still say I'm Dash Lawrence.
Speaker 2:And I'll still remind you that you're Executive Director of the Jewish Independent.
Speaker 1:And you're still Tammy Sussman.
Speaker 2:And this is episode 15 of A Shame to Admit when there is Peace with Itai Flesher.
Speaker 1:Itai Flesher is the Jerusalem correspondent for the Jewish Independent. For over 20 years he has worked as an educator, journalist and peace builder in Melbourne and Jerusalem. He is the author of the upcoming book the Holy and the Broken. Itai is also the education director at the youth movement that brings together Israeli and Palestinian teenagers believing in building equality, justice and peace for all.
Speaker 2:We hope that our conversation acts as the soothing salve that everyone needs right now.
Speaker 1:Itai Fesher, thank you for joining us on A Shame to Admit. Thank you, it's good to be here, isai. Our editor-in-chief, deborah Stone, in her article this week addressing the deaths of the six young Israeli hostages, said that the past few days have been the hardest in the Jewish world since the 7th of October. We have got you on the program this week to talk all about that, but first I wanted to find out from you as an Israeli, as an Australian Jew, as someone who is currently in Jerusalem, how have those last few days been for you?
Speaker 3:So I live in Jerusalem in the same neighborhood as Hirsch, and my entire neighbourhood has seen Hirsch every day. He's on every bus stop, he's on every light post. You go jogging in Gunsucker, it's all over there. It's on buses, it's on street signs and there's beautiful photos of him hiking and dancing and smiling and at a party, and you know different signs. Sometimes it's just graffiti. Hirsch is alive and so I know. In the rest of the country there's pictures of lots of different hostages, because obviously there's still hundreds of them, but in Jerusalem there's only one hostage and it's Hirsch. So I never met Hirsch, even though my wife works with his mother, rachel. But I think every person in Jerusalem just felt like they knew Hirsch because he was this kid that we'd seen every day.
Speaker 3:For you know 330 days, and then we all feel like we know his parents, because his parents are probably, I think, of all the hostages, the most visible and they're also the only hostage family that speaks in English, which also, for Anglo-Jerusalem, also makes it more accessible. And then, to add to that, they're just incredibly eloquent and measured in the way they speak. So, yeah, the day that he passed away there was a big memorial in Bucca, at the community centre that some thousand people came to where we had, you know, prayers and lit candles. Then the following day was the funeral, and then last night was the first night of shiva. There's a big tent outside their house that I attended. It was also thousands of people and I think everyone is just in deep, deep sadness and shock and no one wanted it to end this way.
Speaker 2:And just for our non-Jewish listeners, just a quick explainer of shiva. Can you explain that, Itai? You could probably do a better job than me.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so shiva is a Jewish period of mourning, and I think one of the rituals of shiva that was I don't know if non-Jews would have known about it was very visible was that when you begin the funeral, you have to tear your clothes. You tear the top part of your garment, and so in this funeral that was, by the way, it's the first funeral of any Israeli killed this war that was broadcast live on CNN, on BBC, on every Israeli station. It was probably one of the most viewed funerals in the last few years. So you see all of the speakers, john and Rachel and Libby Orley, the sisters of Hirsch, with torn garments. And now, in our time, why did you come to a funeral wearing a torn garment? But the idea of tearing over your heart is to say you know, my heart is broken and even the clothes over my heart are not complete.
Speaker 2:One of my friends in Australia's, a poet, has said that she feels like we're all walking around with invisible tears on our clothes.
Speaker 3:Rachel talked about suffering third-degree burns of the soul.
Speaker 1:Can we just talk about Hirsch Goldberg for a moment, because I know that you've been posting about him for a number of months now and you touched on the fact that he was a Jerusalem resident and in some way you felt you knew him because of his connection to your city. But what else was it about him that seemed to capture the hearts of so many Israelis and Jews around the world? Because among all the many hostages that have either been captured or we now know to be dead, there was something about him and his story that seems to have struck a real chord with people.
Speaker 3:So I think a lot of it has to do with his parents, because they were his voice for the last 330 days and the way they conducted themselves. Also their incredible social media outreach daily having videos of Hirsch on family holidays, hirsch celebrating a Jewish festival or a birthday. We learnt about his love of football through the Hapoyul Shalem football club, and those football fans came to all of the protests and they were in there in full force waving their flags at the funeral as well. We learnt about his best friend, aneer, who was killed on October 7th. There was also a video released while he was in captivity.
Speaker 3:I don't know, there's just something about his story and we learnt a lot more about him at the funeral that he was just an incredible person, that one of the stories Rachel told about him, which I actually only learnt at the funeral, was that a couple of years ago there was a big debate about asylum seekers in Israel and whether Israel would allow asylum seekers from Eritrea and Sudan to stay, and he was very much in favor of being a home for them and he said to his mother you know, I've looked in our house and there's a cupboard here, there's a washing machine here, you know I think we can hide at least three of them Trying to think of how could we help other people. He had a sign in his room in English, hebrew and Arabic that said Jerusalem is for everyone. There's graffiti on Palka Mesila. It's a like a big mural of different people playing soccer that he painted with his friends. So when I walk past that in my daily walks I always think of him because it's also got a message of peace and coexistence through sport there. So he just seems like he's an incredible individual.
Speaker 3:And John also said at the funeral you know, if Hirsch was conducting these negotiations, hirsch would have been out by now. So that's the kind of person he was, and I think there's a great sadness that we're not ever going to see him being adults. We're never going to see him get married. We're never going to see what he would have done for the world. We just. He's going to be forever 23.
Speaker 1:One of the striking features of his funeral was the presence of President Herzog, who was there and, from all the footage and the photography that I've seen, was clearly visibly upset, distressed and expressed his remorse publicly that Israel had failed to both protect Hirsch on October 7th and to bring him home alive. He said I ask for forgiveness in the name of the state of Israel. I apologize that the country you immigrated to at the age of seven, wrapped in the Israeli flag, could not keep you safe. It's an extraordinary statement from the president of Israel. What do you read into that statement? Itai.
Speaker 3:You know I mean John and Rachel also apologized to Hirsch in their eulogy and it was actually the one part of their eulogy I didn't agree with because I was like what haven't these two people done in the last 330 days? You know, they've met with the Pope. They've spoken at the UN. They spoke at the DNC of millions of people. They went to Gaza and spoke over a megaphone. They were on social media every day. They contacted every influencer possible. They tried to liaise with people from the hostage negotiations. They even offered to lead the hostage negotiations at one point on behalf of the families. I can't think of two parents that didn't leave a single stone unturned and then to hear them at the funeral saying we're sorry, we didn't do enough. I mean, what more could you have done? But I think I think the sorry from the president and from John and Rachel really alludes to something, and I actually saw it on the.
Speaker 3:On the day that the news came, at six o'clock on a Sunday, I went for a walk in Jerusalem with a friend just to process, and there's one of the big billboards that has his face on it. Someone had taken masking tape that you know John and Rachel wear every day with the numbers, and instead of writing the day of the numbers, they just wrote the Hebrew word slicha. And so on. This billboard is masking tape with the word sorry, and John mentioned at the funeral that, more than any other message that he'd received from you know, thousands of people on WhatsApp was sorry Because I think on October 7th, we all felt that the state had let us down, that the state hadn't protected us from Hamas, which is what it was meant to do and on September 1st, we felt that we let us down.
Speaker 3:On September 1st, we felt that we let us down. We weren't there. We should have been able, through a deal, to prevent this from happening. And so it's a different level of disappointment, because disappointing with a state is obviously heartbreaking and challenges your identity, but disappointment with yourself is something that sits on your soul much heavier, and I think the sorry from the president and the sorry from John and Rachel and even Netanyahu also apologised as well. I don't know how sincere that was, but I think there is a sense of we let ourselves down here, and I think that's if I had to summarise the feeling. It wasn't meant to end like this.
Speaker 2:There are some people in Israel who blame Netanyahu for the deaths of Hirsch and the other young hostages. We'll mention their name shortly. They think that Netanyahu could have should have brokered a hostage deal a long, long time ago, but has been too concerned with retaining power. Are you Itai sympathetic to that line of argument?
Speaker 3:Itai sympathetic to that line of argument? Yes, I am. I think there was clearly a deal on the table that actually included some of the names of these hostages. In July, there were the people in the negotiations themselves the head of the Mossad, the defence minister, the chief of staff of the army and also people in the opposition who were part of the coalition Gadi Aizenkot, benny Gantz all of them intimately involved in negotiations said that there were many deals on the table, that Israel was close many times and at each occasion Netanyahu would add in another criteria, another obstacle that would make the deal fall.
Speaker 3:And so there is a very strong feeling among Israelis you know, up a half million Israelis protest this week we had a national strike about this as well that Netanyahu is not doing all of despite him saying I'm doing all that I can that he's not doing all he can to bring these hostages home, and that again causes immense anger and immense frustration.
Speaker 3:Because, you know, no one expects anything of Hamas. Everyone expects Hamas to be Hamas because they're Hamas. But you expect your own government that you elected, that represents your people, to be better, to rise above to. You know, israel is so inventive in finding problem solutions to unsolvable problems, inventive in finding problem solutions to unsolvable problems, whether they be medical problems, scientific problems, technology problems, and the fact that apparently our greatest mind sat in these negotiations for 330 days and you know and did a deal in November. You know there was a deal in November that released 105 hostages. So we know that deals are possible and we know that Hamas will keep a deal when it was made in November and the fact that that wasn't able to happen again since then, despite all the efforts of the Americans and the Egyptians and the Qataris, is heartbreaking.
Speaker 1:One of the sticking points in the most recent round of negotiations was the Philadelphia Corridor, and a fortnight ago, so prior to the discovery of Hirsch Goldberg and the other five young hostages you wrote an article for TJI with the provocative headline is the Philadelphia Corridor really worth more than the lives of the hostages? For those who haven't been following this closely, what is the Philadelphia corridor and why does it represent such a sticking point, such a barrier for this Netanyahu government to progress with these negotiations over the hostages?
Speaker 3:So the Field of the Koryo Bo is essentially the border between Israel and Egypt in the southern part of the Gaza Strip and it's a part of the Gaza Strip that Israel only occupied about two months ago. So the first eight months of the war it wasn't in our hands, it is now in our hands and basically in all of the war it wasn't in our hands, it is now in our hands. And basically in all of the negotiations the demand of Hamas to release the hostages has been that Israel withdraw from the Philadelphia Corridor and many other aspects. But that's been a key sticking point as well, and Netanyahu's firm demand has been that Israel not withdraw from the Philadelphia Corridor. Now again, the defense Minister, the Chief of Staff, the head of the Mossad, the head of the Shin Bet, many of the people who were security experts, have said that Israel can withdraw from the Philadelphia Corridor and there are other arrangements that can prevent weapon smuggling through there through having the corridor monitored by the US and foreign powers and various technological methods, and that these areas will suffice to keep Israel safe from future smuggling through there. And Netanyahu said no, there has to be Israeli troops on that corridor, essentially indefinitely. He didn't give a date when he ever wanted them to leave. This area needs to be permanently reoccupied.
Speaker 3:And so there's a question of is this corridor that Israel, for the first eight months of the war, didn't touch? You know, if it was so essential, why didn't we go in there on day one? It was only eight months into the war that we went in there, and now it's become like the Temple Mount. It's become the most essential part of Israel that we can't live without. And I think a lot of Israelis are asking how did this be elevated to the status that it is when it wasn't before? And also even before 2005, when Israel occupied Gaza through the settlement in Bush Katif, we controlled the Philadelphia Coriladelphia corridor and there was still terrorism, still violence and shootings and all of these sorts of things. Because weapons don't come through the philadelphia corridor. They either come under it, through tunnels or in other ways, or in fact, weapons are produced in gaza through the materials that they have there.
Speaker 3:And I think I think more broadly in netanyahu's idea. The thing that brings safety is walls, is checkpoints, is the Philadelphia corridor, is the Netsarim corridor. They'll always be something else and I guess, from my opinion, the thing that brings safety is agreements. You know why aren't we at war with Egypt? Egypt killed 2,600 people in the Yom Kippur War. We're not at war with Egypt now because we have an Kippur War. We're not at war with Egypt now because we have an agreement with them. Why are we not at war with Jordan now? They also attacked Israel many times. We're at war with them because Rabin signed an agreement in 1994.
Speaker 3:Hamas is a vile terror organization and they need to be replaced. 330 days into the war, netanyahu still hasn't said who he wants to replace. He said Israel doesn't want to reoccupy the Gaza Strip. He doesn't. He doesn't talk about even once who he wants to replace them there. And unless, unless you have a solution of how to replace them with another force, an international force or the Palestinian Authority and that has to be a force that you can make an agreement with then this war is going to continue indefinitely, and I think a lot of Israelis see the Field Delphi Corridor as just an excuse to continue the war forever.
Speaker 3:On the other hand, israelis on the right of which there are many as well are not on the right, but many believe Netanyahu and many believe that the field health corridor is essential and that they're very proud of Netanyahu for sticking up to international pressure from many different countries to let go of this corridor, and they think that he's doing the right thing.
Speaker 3:And I think, especially after his long press conference on Tuesday night this week, I imagine he will get a bump in the polls because I think he made a very convincing case for why he's doing what's best for Israel and that military pressure will release the hostages. So I think the hostages in Israel are really they've become a left-right issue. It's sad to say this, but if you ask me who you voted for in the last election, I can probably. That's probably the best indicator of whether you prefer the hostages or the Philadelphia Corridor, which I know is very different from Australia, where in Australia generally, the more conservative you are, the more you care about Israeli hostages with the right-wing parties, especially Smotrich and Beng Bir, being actively against any form of deal, saying any form of deal as capitulation to Hamas and to Sinoir and, you know, referencing some of the hostages, including Hirsch Goldberg.
Speaker 1:You said we may never see Hirsch Goldberg, pollen, nama Levy or Leary-Albach home, but we will have the Philadelphia corridor. We may never see the beautiful faces of Ariel and Kafir Bibas again, but we will have the Philadelphia corridor. This small piece of land has become our new temple mount. It's the reason we have no deal, the reason we continue to fight and the reason why we may win many battles but ultimately lose the war.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I think that's what's happening. Hamas has been largely destroyed. Hamas has very little ability at the moment to harm Israel or to carry out October 7th. So in the sense we've won the battle against Hamas, but we very much lost the war. We lost a sense of social solidarity, a sense of the social fabric.
Speaker 3:You know, we were very united after October 7th and now we're more divided than I can ever remember because of this feeling that the you know, I guess people like me feel like the government just can't put the lives of these hostages first and that more and more hostages are going to come home now in coffins and not alive. And that's heartbreaking. And, you know, ironically, the only way to win this war through a deal which is also a win for Hamas. And now we have to choose, really between a win-win situation and a lose-lose situation, and I think we've chosen the lose-lose and again, that's heartbreaking. I know political leaders are in a very complicated situation and they have to make very hard decisions, but you know, in the way that I see the world, I always prefer a win-win over a lose-lose.
Speaker 2:When we weren't recording. I told you that I was ashamed to admit I'd never heard of the Philadelphia corridor before, and you said.
Speaker 3:I said a lot of Israelis had never heard of the Philadelphia corridor until a month ago, and that's why a lot of people feel like it's this new obstacle that came out of nowhere.
Speaker 2:Okay. So if any listeners are like me and feeling ashamed, don't be. Yes, you're in the majority this time. Yeah, one of the things that I really admire about you, and why so many of our listeners wanted you to come back on the show, is because you have this amazing capacity to hold hope even when you're in the depths of your grief. You wrote a poem that you published to your social media account. Are you happy to read that? Sure, I'll just open it up.
Speaker 3:Okay, happy to read that. Sure, I'll just open it up, okay. So this is a poem I wrote after the funeral of Hirsch, and it was also after I'd spent a day with Maoz Inon and Aziz Abusala, two friends of mine, an Israeli and Palestinian peacemaker who have both lost loved ones and reject revenge, and through conversations with them and other peacemakers, I was trying to imagine a different reality, because I think often when you're in the depth of despair, that's the time when you think nothing will ever be different. And so this is what I wrote. It's called when there Is Peace, after the bombings of Gaza cease, the hostages come home and all displaced residents from southern Lebanon and northern Israel finally return to their homes, there will be immense spiritual and moral reckoning.
Speaker 3:Palestinians will mourn at the graves of Tamar and Yonatan Simantov and their beautiful children, shachar, arbel and Omel, who were slain in what should have been their safe room on Kibbutz Nir Oz on October 7. Israelis will mourn at the graves of Mohammed Abu al-Qassam's four-day-old twins killed in Gaza, his baby boy Asil and baby girl Asil. They will remember his wife, jumana Rafa, a pharmacist, who survived the whole nine months of pregnancy in Gaza and throughout the war, only to be killed four days after she brought her twins into this world through a miraculous caesarean birth. The Palestinian Prime Minister will lay a wreath at the Nova Memorial and the Israeli Prime Minister will lay a wreath atop the ruins of a once Gaza city, formerly the most populated Palestinian city on earth. When there is peace, few will forgive, none will forget, but we will all commit to ensuring that no such horror is ever repeated. When there is peace, our children will learn that Hashem and Allah want this land to be shared and that what is hateful to you must never be done to others.
Speaker 3:When there is peace, jews, muslims, christians across the world who support Palestine and Israel will again be able to break bread together, share their faiths and find common cause in the Abrahamic traditions. When there is peace, released Palestinian prisoners will call for a truth and reconciliation, just as did the released prisoners from South Africa and Northern Ireland prisoners from South Africa and Northern Ireland. When there is peace, israeli children will no longer serve in the IDLF unless they choose to, for the army will become an optional choice, side by side with national service and other forms of volunteering that will give back to their country. When there is peace. The greatest battles between Israel and Palestine will be at the European Cup final or the Olympic judo mat. When there is peace, nations of the world will look to this land as a beacon of hope, where anything is possible. All of this can happen when there is peace.
Speaker 1:Beautiful words, Itai.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's beautiful. I actually think we should name this episode when there Is Peace with Itai Flesher.
Speaker 3:Can I just share another story on that and this is also something I picked up from Maoz and Aziz is that, when you know, I'm a history teacher and so my job is to tell what happened in the past and explain how it shapes the future. But, as every history teacher knows, history is very disputed, so there's many historical events where a lot of people don't remember the events in the same way, and there's something about dominant narratives of history that can reinforce certain things in the future. So I'll give you an example. The way most Israelis remember October 7th is Hamas came in and killed thousands of people for no reason. Now there's another way to tell October 7th, which is that Hamas came in and they killed lots of people, but there were also many Muslims who saved Jews that day. There were many Bedouins that drove into and drove people out of the Nova Party and security guards, and there were several Muslims who were taken hostage as well.
Speaker 3:So you can tell October 7th and this is how Rachel always told the story of October 7th as not just an attack on Jews, but an attack on good people of many different religions who are all trying to help each other survive against this evil, and good people who are both Jews and Muslims, and Christians and Thai workers and Buddhists were taken hostage. So you can tell it in a multi-faith way. You can tell the story of Gaza as Israel destroyed and starved and did unspeakable crimes to Gaza. Or you can tell the story of what's happening this week, where, standing together, have raised over 7 million shekels to send 200 trucks of aid into Gaza, because all raised by Israelis who are horrified about the humanitarian situation there and don't want people there to be hungry.
Speaker 3:So there's every dominant narrative always has a counter narrative that shows the humanity, the care and compassion that people have for people that are not their religion and not their faith, and so both when I tell history, I always tell the dominant narrative, but I always tell this other narrative as well, and I think the key to peacemaking is to always look at these stories throughout our history of Israeli-Palestinian cooperation, of Jewish-Muslim cooperation as well, that go back thousands of years, from the golden age of Spain to Iraq, where my parents are from. And I think the holding onto these stories is what gives me hope, because it helps me see both the past in a different way and that allows me to see a different future.
Speaker 2:Thank you, Itay Shkoyach Itay. When are you writing a book about all of this?
Speaker 3:So did you not know that I have a book coming?
Speaker 2:out. I did know. I just didn't know if I was allowed to know.
Speaker 3:Yes, I know because, okay, yes, so I have written a book about this. It's a book I've been writing for the past year. It's called the Holy and the Broken. It's coming out with HarperCollins in January and I'll be in Australia in February in Perth, sydney and Melbourne for book launches and it's a book about why I believe that peace is possible and what needs to happen in terms of our education, security, political and just personal relationships with each other to make this happen. It's based on the thousands of hours of dialogue I've facilitated between Israeli and Palestinian children over the last six years and I hope it's a book a lot of people read.
Speaker 3:There's a lot of Australia in the book as well. There's a lot about my childhood and my upbringing and how I came to believe what I believe. There's letters to Israeli and Palestinian children about what I hope for them. There's letters to Israeli and Palestinian children about what I hope for them. There's chapters about history and there's a lot of hope. It's also mentioned my website, itayau I-double-T-A-Yau. You can order the book now. Pre-ordering helps. Pre-ordering definitely helps from Amazon and all the other good bookstores and, yeah, I'm looking forward to telling you about it.
Speaker 1:Okay, well, I look forward to having a conversation with you on this podcast when you're face-to-face with us in either Melbourne or Sydney in February next year.
Speaker 3:Looking forward to seeing you there.
Speaker 1:Hopefully we are talking under better, brighter circumstances.
Speaker 3:Inshallah. May the war be over by then, and may we be talking about, instead of mourning war, how to build peace.
Speaker 2:Thanks, itay Dash and I also wanted to mention that, in addition to Hirsch Goldberg-Pollen's body, the bodies of Ori Danino, eden Yerushalmi, almog Sarusi, alexander Lobanov and Carmel Gatt were all found. We know that five of them were taken from Nova Music Festival and Carmel was taken from Kibbutz Be'eri. She was there visiting her parents. They survived almost 11 months in captivity before they were shot by Hamas. May their memories be a blessing.
Speaker 1:And we'd like to end this episode with a song. In the days after the October 7th attacks, the Melbourne-based band the Becheva Singers were inspired by a poem by early 20th century Warsaw writer, poet and mystic, hillel Zeitlin. The poem was called Mysterium Hidden Places and it was Zeitlin's response to the pogroms of 1918 and 1920, in which more than 100,000 Jews were murdered. That's it for today. You've been listening to A Shame to Admit. With Tammy Sussman and me, dash Lawrence, this is a TJI podcast.
Speaker 2:Today's episode was mixed and edited by Nick King.
Speaker 1:Links to.
Speaker 2:The articles relevant to today's episode are in the show notes. If you like the podcast, leave a positive review, tell your friends or become a sponsor.
Speaker 1:You can get in touch with us via the contact form on the Jewish Independent website or by emailing ashamed at thejewishindependentcomau.
Speaker 2:As always, thanks for your support. Take care of yourselves and look out for us next Tuesday. Un oiv geboit belen.
Speaker 3:Belen Ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh, ooh, ooh Stuben.
Speaker 1:So Poison Blenden, Thank you. We had so much fun With a quiet soul away as if it beats and pains Deinix deine Kinder.