Ashamed to Admit

Episode #27 'Girl in Finance' with Blossom's Gaby Rosenberg

• The Jewish Independent • Season 2 • Episode 27

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In this episode, your favourite ‘girl, interrupted’ chats to her favourite ‘girl, in finance’ Gaby Rosenberg from Blossom. Gaby talks about her (and her sister Ali’s) journey to becoming co-founders of a startup and explains some basic investment terms. Tami spontaneously cries like she did in primary school maths and they both open up about the pressures of having financial security as adults. Plus Dash reveals something he’s ashamed to admit and it has nothing to do with a bidet. 

Relevant articles: 

https://thejewishindependent.com.au/how-could-it-happen-here

https://thejewishindependent.com.au/we-so-need-more-jewish-characters-who-arent-rich

https://thejewishindependent.com.au/a-new-path-forward-for-homeless-australian-jewish-youth

Listen to our episode: Are all Australian Jews Rich? https://ashamedtoadmit.buzzsprout.com/2345229/episodes/15057407-episode-7-are-all-australian-jews-rich-no-do-you-have-a-hot-ancestor-yes-plus-a-giveaway

Email your feedback and voice memos here: ashamed@thejewishindependent.com.au

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Speaker 1:

Are you interested in Jewish issues? But a little bit ashamed that you're barely keeping up to date, that you just don't have enough prerequisite knowledge to hold your own at family dinners.

Speaker 2:

If you answered yes, well, you've come to the right place.

Speaker 1:

And if you answered no, this might not be the right podcast for you, but hang around anyway. We might change your mind.

Speaker 2:

I'm Dash Lawrence and in this podcast series, your third cousin, tammy Sussman, and I call on experts and each other to address all the ignorant questions that you might be too ashamed to ask.

Speaker 1:

Join us as we have a go at cutting through some seriously chewy and dewy topics.

Speaker 2:

Welcome to the Jewish Independent podcast. Ashamed to Admit. Hello everyone. I'm Dash Lawrence, executive Director here at the Jewish Independent.

Speaker 1:

And I dropped maths in Year 11.

Speaker 2:

And you're also Tammy Sussman.

Speaker 1:

How's your maths Dash?

Speaker 2:

Not great If I could have dropped maths in Year 11, I would have but it was compulsory in South Australia to do some form of maths or science. So I elected to do in year 11 and year 12 what was cruelly termed dumbass maths. So it was like, yeah, the most sort of elementary maths level you could take in years 11 and 12.

Speaker 1:

Well, it's kind of a blessing in disguise for you, because now you're executive director, big dog of the Jewish Independent, and you kind of need to like know about numbers and money and stuff, I'm assuming.

Speaker 2:

To an extent like, yeah, spreadsheets are certainly something that I rely a lot more upon these days, in ways that I didn't expect I would for a career. I actually quite like them. Now I've become I'm not ashamed to admit a bit of an Excel demon. I own it. I love it.

Speaker 1:

I assume you're also good at spreadsheets, because you need to use them for your renovations budget. Do you have a budget for your renovations and, more importantly, is the bidet going to blow it?

Speaker 2:

The bidet was not something I would have put as a non-negotiable. Someone else, who's part of these decisions, a key stakeholder in these decisions was of the view that that was a non-negotiable in the budget. You've got to stick to the budget as best as you can.

Speaker 1:

You've got to make some sacrifices, right?

Speaker 2:

Some compromises along the way. So you know, the Finnish sauna had to go. Unfortunately, that couldn't be added. The ice plunge bath that was to be imported from Norway, that also had to go, Okay. So, tammy, I'm curious what is all this talk of maths, spreadsheets and home ownership about? What's something in your mind with regard to all of this?

Speaker 1:

Well Dash, it's no secret that we're living through a cost of living crisis at the moment, especially in Sydney, which we've now discovered when we compared our rentals Sydney's twice the price of Melbourne, I believe.

Speaker 2:

But twice the fun. I'm sure Tammy Twice the beauty.

Speaker 1:

Certainly in my home, and I know what some of our listeners are thinking. They're thinking Tammy easy move to Melbourne.

Speaker 2:

We've got plenty of room for you.

Speaker 1:

I could move to Melbourne, but I'd have no family, and I think asking a Jewish person to move away from their family is like having a body part amputated.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, realistically, it's not going to happen. Right, you're going to be staying in Sydney for, very likely, for the rest of your days, exactly.

Speaker 1:

And we've spoken about money on the show before. Back in season one, we unpacked the stereotype, so I asked the question are all Australian Jews rich? And you provided me with some statistics that proved the point. No, no, they're not. And in today's show proved the point no, no, they're not. And in today's show I talked financial literacy and entrepreneurship with Gabby Rosenberg from Blossom Dash. You couldn't make it to this interview.

Speaker 2:

That's right. Yes, I was too busy looking over my spreadsheets and counting my pennies. No, not true. Couldn't make it because-.

Speaker 1:

Okay, I'm not interested in your excuses, dash.

Speaker 2:

Okay, tell me how did your interview go, because last time you had a solo interview, I seem to recall there were some technical issues.

Speaker 1:

There were many technical issues last time. I had a solo interview this week. I didn't have any technical issues, I just had issues. Dash, I started to cry mid-interview.

Speaker 2:

Okay, what brought that on?

Speaker 1:

My personality brought it on, but some more context Dash. You're a historian so I know you'll appreciate this story. When I was in primary school, I used to have anxiety, but it was the 90s so it hadn't been branded as anxiety yet. It was just. People would tell me I was a worry wart, and the place or the space where this manifested the most was in maths lessons.

Speaker 2:

Me too.

Speaker 1:

Oh really.

Speaker 2:

Because I was terrible at my times tables and in year six our primary school teacher our classroom teacher put all the students in group A, b, c and D on the wall with their names clearly marked out at where they were performing with maths and with times tables, and I was at the bottom of like near the bottom of group D. That was very shameful. It did not fill me with confidence. I was a sensitive little boy. I think I would be holding back tears from time to time in maths lessons and with my times tables.

Speaker 1:

Holding back, so you never let them out.

Speaker 2:

It would be a very shameful thing for a boy to firstly be bad at maths, because there's this sort of weird expectation that men are supposed to be good at numbers and figures but not good at articulation and communication and words and literacy, which were more my strengths, was the reverse, so being bad in that domain and then getting upset about it, which was something that you know would typically be put onto girls. So, yeah, it was quite a shameful thing to be both bad at maths and inclined to be getting upset about it.

Speaker 1:

So, yeah, you're not the only one, tammy, no and I'm sure that there are listeners who can relate. I'm just amazed at your ability, or anyone's ability, to be able to hold back tears. I was unable to hold back my tears in maths. I was terrible with numbers. I was allergic to peanuts and numbers. So even now, come tax time, I panic. I pay someone else to do my tax return. But they ask me questions. They say, tammy, I need some information before I do this. And just getting the information to answer the questions that the tax accountant gives me makes me nauseous. And don't even ask me how I feel when I see my net income for the financial year. And I've shared this with my friends. So many people tell me. It's really common for women, for people, assigned female at birth in our community, particularly those who've been in long-term relationships with men. So a few years ago when I heard about the Rosenberg sisters who'd started Blossom, I was very intrigued.

Speaker 2:

So a little bit about today's interviewee. Before starting Blossom app, gabby Rosenberg worked in the fast-paced world of tech startups, taking on a variety of roles in industries like wellness and automotive. In 2020, gabby joined the Startmate Fellowship, a program for aspiring entrepreneurs With a commerce degree under her belt, gabby turned her vision into a reality, combining her financial expertise with her hands-on startup experience expertise with her hands-on startup experience. Today, gabby is the co-founder of Blossom App, a savings app providing unprecedented access to fixed income investing. What's that? You'll find out in a moment. Blossom app now serves over 23,000 customers and with $92 million in funds under management, gabby is passionate about making sophisticated investment opportunities accessible to everyday savers.

Speaker 1:

Okay. So there'll be some listeners who are also financially illiterate who'll really appreciate the part of the interview where I ask Gabby to explain things to me like she's my bat mitzvah teacher. And there'll be other listeners who are all over that side of things and I encourage you not to switch off because I'm sure you're all going to love my interview with the whip, smart and empathetic Gabby Rosenberg, who is helping young people change the way they think about investing. Gabby Rosenberg, thank you so much for joining us on A Shame to Admit. Thank you, it's great to be here. I'm very excited, gabby. It's just you and me today. My co-host Dash was supposed to be here, but he lives in Melbourne, which means that he can afford to purchase land and build a home, and he has a very important meeting with the plumber because he's in the process of choosing a bidet. He does send his apologies. I am curious to know if you've had any experience with bidets.

Speaker 3:

I went on exchange to Utrecht in the Netherlands and one of my housemates was Italian and she just couldn't believe that she couldn't use a bidet every day and couldn't believe the filth that she was walking around in. You know.

Speaker 1:

Gabby, I'm nervous that Dash will have stern words with me if I don't ask you some biographical details, because, as well as being the executive director of the Jewish Independent and a journalist author himself, he's a historian. So are you able to tell our listeners a little bit about yourself?

Speaker 3:

So I grew up in Sydney. I was born and bred here, which is very, very lucky and fortunate. I'm 28 years old. I am one of four girls, two sets of twins. So I have a twin and my older sisters are also twins, which is always like my icebreaker, like tell us a fun fact about yourself and I'm like, oh my God, I have three sisters, we're all twins and, yeah, it's always been lots of fun at home.

Speaker 1:

Are you ashamed to admit that you grew up in the eastern suburbs of Sydney, because it can usually be a bit of a butt of the joke, or have you come to terms with that and you're owning it?

Speaker 3:

no, definitely owning it. It's my favorite place in the whole world.

Speaker 1:

Get me to bondi beach which is where I'm recording from today, hence there's a bit of background noise.

Speaker 3:

You just don't realize how bloody noisy it is wow, my sister also just moved out of my parents place and into bondi and she said it's like new york city. I was. I don't think it's like New York City, but I get what you mean.

Speaker 1:

Now growing up at home, you said it was a fun place with all your sisters. Was finance a recurring theme in your dinner time conversation?

Speaker 3:

Well, we grew up in a big family of financial professionals, so my dad, my uncles, my cousins, my grandparents everyone was in finance and so, yes, it did make up a big part of the discussion around the dinner table, but I think it was something that I really enjoyed, because there was always interesting discussion, there was always new ideas, new opportunities, new asset classes being brought to the dinner table for discussion, and it's actually the reason that Ali and I ended up starting Blossom, and that's because during COVID, we were all stuck at home, so there was a lot of time for dinnertime conversation, and one time the point of discussion was fixed income, which is the asset class that Blossom invests in, and Ali and I are quite risk averse in terms of how we manage our money, and fixed income is on the less risky side, although there's still an element of risk, like there is with any investment opportunity and we started doing our own research after the dinner table discussion and we found high minimums, long lockups, high fees for someone else to manage your money, and so we took this and we started trying to figure out a way that we could bring this awesome investment opportunity to everyone, because we knew it was something that was attractive for us.

Speaker 3:

It probably would be for friends, family, colleagues as well, and that's what set us on the journey to being Blossom.

Speaker 1:

Okay, so let's take a few steps back. Was this something that you and Ali studied at university, or was this a COVID career pivot?

Speaker 3:

So this is something that Ali and I studied. Ali did finance, I did a commerce degree, majoring in international business, and when I finished uni I didn't really want to go and do the whole pencil skirt, corporate job thing because I didn't really think that it was me. I'm more like a t-shirts, jeans and kicks kind of girl. So that's what I did. I went to find cool tech startups that I could join. I joined a tech startup in the wellness space and then I went to another tech startup in the automotive industry and then that's when COVID hit and we were ready to jump in and use some of what we'd learned at uni and we started working on the business in 2020, but we launched in 2021. So it's been about three and a half, almost four years. I think we'll still be a tech startup until maybe year seven, and then I guess you they call you a scale up because you're scaling, you're growing.

Speaker 1:

So you mentioned some terms before fixed income, something, something. I'm ashamed to admit that when I went on to the Blossom website, there was some lingo there, some jargon, some terms that overwhelmed me. Gabby, can you help me understand? Start with whatever concept you think will be best for the uninitiated like myself Perfect.

Speaker 3:

Love the uninitiated. I think it's helpful to start with fixed income, because that's like the broader asset class, and then bond is a type of fixed income product. So fixed income, because that's like the broader asset class, and then bond is a type of fixed income product. So fixed income is it's what's called a defensive asset class, so you're not chasing growth. It's a little bit more of a defensive way to invest your money, a little bit more risk averse, as some might say, and it's basically. It's quite simple. When you get to the bottom of it, it's just an investment type that pays investors a fixed return over the maturity date, which just means until the investment period is over.

Speaker 3:

So with shares, I think, just because of how big the stock market is, a lot of people can be a little bit more familiar with how shares work rather than bonds.

Speaker 3:

A share is performance-based, so your return depends on how well the company does that you've invested in. So you might get Apple shares, for example, that one year they pay you 2% and then the next year Apple has an incredible year and they pay you 10%, and then the next year it has less good of a year and it pays you 8%. I don't know what Apple is paying, but just by way of example and it just depends on how well the company does that year. But for fixed income and investment products like bonds, they pay you fixed returns throughout the whole investment period. So for example, let's say you make a five-year investment at a rate of 5%. So after year one you get 5%, and then after year two you also get 5%, and then after year three you still get 5%, and then at the end of the five years. So when your investment period is over, you also get all your money back that you originally invested, plus you get to keep the interest for the five years.

Speaker 1:

Question. At this point you said like flippantly so if you buy you know an Apple share, how much money do you actually need to buy a share?

Speaker 3:

So shares on the stock market they're all different prices, so I assume that there's probably shares on the stock market now that you can buy for one cent, so you can really get started with a small amount of money. But it just might not be worth it because there might be fees to get on the platform or you might have to pay a broker fees. So you would need to figure out what makes sense for you. But with Blossom our minimum is $5. So you can make a $5 investment and that's what we mean about trying to just open up this new investment class and this awesome investment opportunity for everyone.

Speaker 1:

That's really interesting because in my mind, having like no knowledge, I just thought it was just out of reach. Like you needed a significant amount of money in the first place to make a good investment. Is that wrong?

Speaker 3:

That can be wrong. I guess it always depends on what you're investing in and I can't give anyone personal financial advice.

Speaker 1:

Of course, that's not why I brought you in, by the way.

Speaker 3:

Good to know. Of course, that's not why I brought you in, by the way. Good to know, but depending on the investment, a lot of times you can get started with five dollars and then the whole point is that you're building up your investment over time.

Speaker 1:

Okay okay, cool, so I interrupted you. I'm sorry, that's what I do. You mentioned bonds. What are they?

Speaker 3:

so bonds are common types of fixed income products, which is the fixed income that I was talking about before, and it's a common way for companies and governments to fund their new projects or their ongoing expenses. So, unlike shares, like we talked about before, which are performance-based, like depending on how well the company does the fixed income and bonds.

Speaker 3:

They're fixed returns.

Speaker 3:

So I think the example that I always like to use is let's say I'm the Australian government and I want to build a new stadium for an upcoming event maybe the Olympics or the World Cup and I need to issue bonds to raise money to build my stadium, because I don't have enough to pay it off my own balance sheet. I just don't have enough money Maybe I'm not generating enough through taxes that people are paying and so I issue a bond to investors that say I need $1,000 to build my stadium, which I'm going to promise. I promise I'll give you $1,000 back in five years and then to incentivize you to give me $1,000, I'm also going to pay you an interest rate of 5% every year. So I'll give you $50 back for giving me your a thousand dollars, which is 5%, just 50 on a thousand dollars and then I'll give you that $50 every single year for the five years, and then at the end of the five years, I'm also going to give you your a thousand dollars back. Plus you keep all the interest that I gave you from before.

Speaker 3:

So at the end of the day, everyone's happy because I got the money I needed to build my stadium, I gave you your money back, plus you get to keep all the interest payments and it basically is a, I guess, a win-win for everyone. And it's why bonds are often viewed as more predictable and stable investment and they help governments and companies fund all sorts of operating activities or projects or new market expansions, etc. And I think from here it's important to explain there's two different types of bonds there's corporate bonds and government bonds, and the government bond we just touched on's the stadium example, but there's also a corporate bond, okay before you go to the corporate bonds.

Speaker 1:

Sorry to interrupt again, gabby. No, please. You said it's everyone wins with the government bonds, but what if your government's like Greece or Lebanon and goes to shit?

Speaker 3:

yeah, probably a bad investment, then Okay.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, okay, good, no further questions. Move on to corporate Okay.

Speaker 3:

And then with corporate bonds. So instead of the government issuing a bond, it's just a company. So let's say Coca-Cola. Or we can go back to Apple. Again, this would be a corporate bond because Apple, let's say, needs to borrow some money from you because they want to open up maybe a borrow some money from you, because they want to open up maybe a new warehouse in Southeast Asia or they want to open a new warehouse in North America and they need the money now to start building the warehouse. So they're going to take the $1,000 that you've kindly borrowed. They'll pay you the interest over time and then, same as the government bond, you get to keep all the interest plus you get your initial investment back.

Speaker 1:

And then apple's happy because now they have their new warehouse okay, I just have to say at this point that this is the most calm I have ever been, with someone explaining all of this stuff to me wow, I'm honored.

Speaker 3:

Thank you, I'm very flattered. We just built a cool app and we have an investment fund called the blossom fund and you can invest some money with us. We basically invest that and pay you a return. And then we do have awesome savings functionality as well, where you can set and track your savings goals. You can set up automated recurring payments. You can try and track your safety net over time.

Speaker 1:

But you're definitely not thinking about having a branch where you have financial tutors.

Speaker 3:

Like money coaches or financial advisors. It is something that we think about a lot because we try and keep everything as easy to understand as possible, and so we naturally are attracting, I guess, a less sophisticated or an earlier investor, attracting, I guess, a less sophisticated or an earlier investor. We try and do that with some of that blog content just explain some of the lingo and the jargon and the tough to understand financial concepts. But in terms of a whole spinoff of financial education, maybe one day I think it's important.

Speaker 1:

Just keep that in mind. Gabby, do you identify as an entrepreneur? Gabby, do you identify as an entrepreneur?

Speaker 3:

Yes, I guess I would be an entrepreneur.

Speaker 1:

Like you're at airport, customs or whatever, and they're like what do you do for work? Or you're on a date and they're like what do you do for work? What do you say?

Speaker 3:

That's a hard one actually sometimes I feel like, because we're just selling Blossom all day, like we're on partnership calls and explaining what we do Anytime outside of work, that maybe I can like steal not having to explain it one more time, just as like a personal win. Sometimes I take those opportunities, but then also my sister would say that like every opportunity to tell someone about what we do it's like one less marketing dollar we have to spend, which I totally agree with, and marketing is expensive. So I don't know, it depends on the day. I normally just say I think I say co-founder.

Speaker 1:

Okay, which?

Speaker 3:

means absolutely nothing and is very non-illustrative, but I write it down anyway, but you are an entrepreneur, right. Yes, I am.

Speaker 1:

Do you identify as a young entrepreneur? Yes, I do.

Speaker 3:

Ali and I just won the Young Entrepreneur Awards. We went to this gorgeous award ceremony in the Ivyy ballroom in the city, which was very nice, and we weren't expecting to win, but we did so we were. We were very flattered, but it was a finance category. So there was like a sustainability category, a property category, a building and construction category, a tech marketing finance category.

Speaker 1:

So we won the finance category when dash and I were in our production meeting for this episode, he said that he feels like we're living in the golden age of young Jewish entrepreneurship. He threw around some names, some businesses Humanitix, adam McCurdy, twob, sustainable Shoes by the Dodon sisters, and there's also Mosh, who sponsored an episode, and Bedthreads, who I'm committed to getting as sponsors of the show. Do you agree with Dash? Do you think that we're living in this golden age of young Jewish entrepreneurs? Do you feel it?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, definitely. I think also we have the After Pays Nick Molnar Zip, which is the Diamond family. Yeah, I think it's been incredible Zara and Sam from the Daily Oz. There's also Lexi and Jodine who started Sorted and they're killing it. So I think there's young Jewish entrepreneurs budding everywhere.

Speaker 1:

And correct me if I'm wrong isn't your sister-in-law also a young Jewish entrepreneur? She sure is.

Speaker 3:

Her name's Kate Ingham and she started Tussle, which is a sexual wellness brand, and she has two lube products out. She has an oil-based lube and a water-based lube. There's more awesome products coming down the line and it's basically a lube that makes you feel a little bit more sexy than the current ones in the market.

Speaker 1:

Because you posted something and I was like that looks fun. I think I thought it was deodorant or something. And then I clicked on it and I was like oh, that is not deodorant.

Speaker 3:

No, it is not.

Speaker 1:

Clicking on that took my Monday night in a very different direction. Good for her. We'll definitely be reaching out to your sister-in-law for potential sponsorship moving forward when she has taken over the world.

Speaker 3:

Great idea.

Speaker 1:

Are you in a group chat with the other Jewish entrepreneurs in Australia and is the name of your group chat Juprachaners?

Speaker 3:

Currently no, but we should change that really, really quickly. Oh so you are in a group, I'm not in a group, but we should change that. We have tried. Every now and then there's been like maybe six or seven of us that have gotten together for a barbecue at one of the big VC founders houses and then we just talk about mutual challenges, growth, how everyone's going, a bit of a knowledge sharing activity, which was awesome but then we never did it again, and I don't know why you said at one of the VC houses what do you mean?

Speaker 3:

so there's um companies called venture capital funds and they fund yeah, they fund early stage startups. If you're not in finance, why are you meant to know any of this stuff?

Speaker 1:

Just feel like that's something that we're kind of meant to know. Do you get invited to exclusive Jewish community events?

Speaker 3:

No, but now I'm wondering should I be getting these invites?

Speaker 1:

I mean, do you want to go to exclusive Jewish events for young entrepreneurs?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I'd like to go every now and then. I do like going home and cooking dinner and reading as well. Introvert Well, actually my whole life I grew up thinking that I was an extrovert, but I think that that's changed in the last three years because everyone says and then you can be like a social introvert, which think that that's changed in the last three years because everyone says and then you can be like a social introvert, which maybe I'm a social introvert, but then I also think it's very people dependent. Like sometimes I'll spend time with someone and I'm like you have just like filled up my cup, I have just recharged all my batteries. Like now I can go and like solve world hunger and other people. I just feel exhausted after. Yeah, drains.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, they drain my battery. I think for the most part, if I've had a busy day, I just want to go home and lie on the couch with a book or a podcast and just not have to open my mouth.

Speaker 1:

Specifically the Ashamed to Admit podcast.

Speaker 3:

Especially that one.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think what I'm hearing from you, gabby, is you're happy to go to an event for young Jewish entrepreneurs, as long as you can wear a t-shirt, jeans and kicks. You nailed it. You mentioned VCs. I didn't know that that meant venture capitalists. I thought VC meant vice captain and I was going to use that as an opportunity to remind you that I was vice captain of Moriah College. Wow, it's a little bit of a flex that I try and work into every episode. Does that impress you?

Speaker 3:

I feel very impressed because my twin sister was also the vice captain of Moriah College. Was she? Yes, and she's the most impressive person I've ever met. So go you.

Speaker 1:

Well, I'm going to reach out to your sister and add her to the WhatsApp group that I have, which is just vice captains.

Speaker 3:

How good would that be? You should.

Speaker 1:

Okay, I'm making jokes because I'm about to get vulnerable with you. So, gabby, I feel like if I were to tell the Jewish community that I've secretly been running a brothel where people come to have Jewish themed sex parties, people would say, oh good for you, like a middle-aged entrepreneur and who supplies your salmon. But if I were to come out and say I'm a lowincome earning Jew, I feel, honestly, I feel a little bit dirty, admitting that. I feel like it's a dirty little secret. I'm even getting emotional now. Sorry to make you feel awkward, I don't feel awkward.

Speaker 3:

I don't feel awkward. Keep going.

Speaker 1:

This is not how I thought this interview would go. I think there's so much emotion attached to this because, especially now after October 7, we hear so much crap about being a dirty, money-hungry Jew. And then there's that stereotype that the Jews are running the world and control all the money and we're obsessed with money and I feel like in our community there are so many people living below the poverty line. I'm friends with so many artists who are really struggling right now, but then if I'm being super, super honest which I always try to do on this show I feel like our community is a little bit obsessed with money and that there is currency with that and people who get respect and power for having money.

Speaker 3:

I definitely agree with, like how the community deals with money and kind of the awe surrounding someone who has a lot of money and you do, you get a fortune of respect and you have doors open for you and you're just treated a little bit differently. I think like I have a few people in mind and I'm just like there's like a different air about you when you walk into the room uh-huh.

Speaker 3:

I think it's like a war, a post-war mentality as well, where, like people just feel motivated, especially after something like October 7th, when it's like, well, actually it's more the aftermath of October 7th than the event itself, but it's like people just are going to hate Jews and they're going to use every reason to not say it. But that's the underlying issue, I guess. And so it just like it kind of empowers and motivates the community, or at least me, like it really, really motivates me to be like I need to be like the master of my own destiny. You know, I need to like not rely on anyone for anything, for any reason, and, yeah, like I just have to be able to look after myself at all costs. And I think like the quickest way to be self-sufficient, I guess, is to be able to like monetarily be able to look after yourself.

Speaker 3:

And generally, in Australia at least, having a lot of money comes with a lot of power and influence on not only our own community but also the greater Australian community. And I think it's just like protection, like it's just risk mitigation and protection, because we just want to survive. That's all we want to do. We want to live happily and freely and we want to be able to go to synagogue safely and go to school safely and without like a very influential community. I just don't think we can do that. I think the want and the focus on money comes from a good place but in application it doesn't always make everyone feel included and it doesn't always present, especially from an outsider, in such a good way. And I think, in terms of the low income earning, like some of the questions that I have, like I guess you explained the emotion behind it, but I did want to ask why it makes you feel so sad. Is there a reason other than, like the October 7th and everyone thinking we're so money hungry and stuff Like what makes you feel so emotional?

Speaker 1:

I think it comes down to. I think it's status. I know there are a lot of people who are my age who have been financially dependent on their partners. They now have kids and they want to set a good example for their kids.

Speaker 1:

But I also think that, yeah, we live in a capitalist society. People are telling me all the time you're doing such great things and you're so funny and I love the different projects that you're doing, and it's like, yes, but sadly, we live in a society where if your tax return doesn't reflect that, then it can be a little bit of a blow, and I know that the Jewish community is a community that is happy to support people. But I also hate asking people for things, and I guess you're in that situation too. But I feel like there's a war happening in Israel, and why should they give me money to sponsor a podcast when they could be using that money to, you know, help people in a war zone? So I think there's so many layers that play into that. This interview isn't about me, though. No, no, it's okay. What kind of pressures do you experience around money? What has your expectation of earning capacity been growing up?

Speaker 3:

So I think growing up I felt a lot less pressure than some of my friends around me did mostly the guys, my guy friends around me Because when I would do the math in my head I would kind of just think that I'm going to marry a man, so there's going to be a double income.

Speaker 3:

So I was kind of just like doubling what my earning capacity was by two, assuming I'd be in like a heterosexual income family.

Speaker 3:

But when I realized that I wanted to marry a woman and then like slowly over time, like with starting Blossom, expecting probably to be the breadwinner, maybe that won't happen. But if I was starting to panic a little bit about how I was going to provide for a family and if it was all going to fall on my shoulders one day, and then looking back and talking to some of my guy friends about it, understanding that from maybe the age of 11, they've had to grow up with these pressures their whole life go into finance, make money you're going to have to provide for a family. So it's all up to you. And I think sometimes that pressure can be crippling. And I'm lucky because I only started to feel it when I was 23 years old and so I could kind of deal with some of that with at least an adult brain, but I can't imagine having to grow up with the weight of that from the time you're 10 or 11.

Speaker 1:

I'm surprised that your male friends have been open with you about that, have they explicitly said I feel the pressure.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, definitely To provide Wow. Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1:

So do you feel like growing up there was pressure on you to not even have a career or be the breadwinner?

Speaker 3:

I don't think so, because we were four girls. I don't know if that dynamic would have changed if there was a boy in the family. But also my dad. He kind of has a perspective of he doesn't expect anything different from us because we're women and it's kind of it's not even a gender discussion in our household. It's more just like well, you're going to have to do something, so you may as well like go big and bold and do the best that you can, but like we don't have conversations at home about being females in finance or potentially being in boardrooms with like 10 white men and me and Ali just sitting there in our little pantsuits. Um. But I think it's a good thing because it doesn't give you an out like it doesn't give you a reason to stop being competitive and keep driving forward and keep growing. So yeah, I don't think we were ever treated any differently as girls.

Speaker 1:

Okay, so I'm going to wrap up this interview by asking you the question I ask everyone who comes on the show, and that is is there anything that you're ashamed to admit? Like in general, what have you got?

Speaker 3:

for me Hit me, so I was thinking about this one. I'm ashamed to admit that I run a finance tech startup but I have to use my calculator for literally everything and my inability to do any mental arithmetic it's astounding. But I just have my calculator with me and I get to the same results as everyone else. I just get flustered when I have to do it on the spot in my head. So I get to the same destination, but quicker, with my calculator.

Speaker 1:

And do you bring in the little calculator that we used to use at Mariah College with the little slidey lid, or do you use the one on your phone? I use the one on my phone, but wow, blast from the past.

Speaker 1:

the slidey lid, the slidey lid and the stickers on it. I just have this image of you and Ali in a boardroom with all these old white men and you come in with, like, your little calculator with the slidey lid and the stickers on it. You're like, hang on a minute, they'd probably love it. They're probably jealous that they can't live their truth and use a slidey calculator.

Speaker 3:

Exactly, and I always have this argument with my dad because he's going to do it in his head. I'm going to do it on the calculator and I'm there like three and a half minutes before he is. I'm like see, I've got three and a half minutes of my day back.

Speaker 1:

It's pride. It is, it's pride. It is okay. Gabby Rosenberg, thank you so much for coming in for, as my therapist sister would say, holding the space. When I got spontaneously emotional for your free tutoring for that 10 minutes, you explained some terms to me. I hope this isn't patronizing, but I'm so proud of you. I know you probably think you're just doing your job, but really I look at you young ones in the community and just I'm in awe. So like, as us geriatric millennials say, keep killing it.

Speaker 3:

Thank you so much. I also have a therapist sister, so we love feelings around here. Feelings are great, feel your feelings, and it was so awesome and so much fun to come on here and chat with you, so thank you for having me.

Speaker 1:

What do you think, Dash? Wasn't she great?

Speaker 2:

She was. I love the energy she brings to conversations about money. You know she's good value, great find, thank you. And yeah, a bit different this week. We don't normally talk about the sort of bread and butter issues, but I think you're right to invite Gabby onto the pod. These are things that are front and centre of all people's minds, jewish or not. It's nice to be able to talk about those issues but also hear clearly a very articulate, very smart young Jewish woman who is one of many leading the charge with a new product, a new app, which I'm sure will be going places over the years to come.

Speaker 1:

She's really such a champ.

Speaker 2:

That's it for another week.

Speaker 1:

You've been listening to. A Shame to Admit with me, tammy Sussman and executive director of TJI, dr Dashiell Lawrence.

Speaker 2:

This episode was mixed and edited by Nick King, with theme music by Donovan Jenks.

Speaker 1:

If you like the podcast, pull over. Stop unpacking the dishwasher. Leave a positive review, tell your people or encourage your third cousin's cousin to sponsor an episode.

Speaker 2:

You can tell us what you're ashamed to admit?

Speaker 1:

Or what you're not ashamed to admit but really should be ashamed to admit.

Speaker 2:

Via the contact form on the Jewish Independent website or by emailing ashamed at thejewishindependentcomau.

Speaker 1:

As always, thanks for your support. Take a deep breath and look out for us next week.

Speaker 2:

For what will be our season finale for season 2 2024. Thank you.